Guilt and how to deal with it:)

Upsi was inspired and wrote about working through guilt.  This in turn has inspired me to write a bit about this as well. If you are in this family rift/estrangement situation, undoubtedly you will feel (well a lot of things) and guilt will be among the party guests:) Many of us have been manipulated at least during our young lives and essentially programed to feel this to even our own reasonable responses, which another person without our history would not even think to feel guilty about.

On the living authentically blog (also referenced by Upsi and now discovered by me), there is this advice:

"There is a process (which comes from gestalt psychotherapy) for working with feeling guilty: underneath guilty there is a resentment and underneath resentment there is a demand. Once you get to the demand you aren’t bothered with feeling guilty anymore.
To experience this:

1. Imagine yourself expressing your guilty feeling to someone. It can be someone you imagine or an idealised figure (like a judge) or the person or group you feel you transgressed against.
2. Express the feeling fully. As you do this you will either finish with the feeling or feel resentment arise. If you don’t feel resentment you are probably finished with feeling guilty.
3. If you feel resentment arise then express this resentment. Allow yourself to be very specific. Be as specific as you can.
4. As you express you resentment you will find that you are making a series of demands. These demands are important. They contain, at their heart, what you need to thrive.
5. As you find a way to get what you are demanding you will find that you are free of feeling guilty. "

From the age of 29 to the age of, er, 46; I have in such a roundabout way, I am sure, gone through this.   So as far as "my parents" are concerned the guilt phase lasted for a long time but finally I went past that.   So since I am in a good place, I would not write out these steps for that experience as I have already embraced my decisions, actions, and intentions with confidence.   I have also given myself the permission not to have to relive this as my "penance".

However, there is a situation regarding an individual of my FOO to where I can apply this.  I had actually promised we would have a phone conversation about this,once I was done enjoying some time off.   You can find part of the situation that I am speaking to in this attached post.

For a little more background, a few weeks ago I was puzzling over the best way to be upfront and direct about this.   A telephone call would have been the right and correct thing to do.   However, I was really stressed out after being so busy with my business (which is good but still makes one edgy and sleep deprived) that I just did not want to get any more emotionally upset or vested in this.   Therefore, here is the totally dysfunctional e-mail response (not so much the response but that I could not deal with it except at an arms length distance at the time).

This is actually an e-mail discussion that happened after my relative sent some third party messages through my husband to me:

Relative on FB to ME: Have Robert call me ASAP.


This is the point where the discussion with Robert to send third party messages also to me took place, and now the rest of the FB discussion is after receiving the messages from my husband.


Me on FB: Hey [Relative], I don't have your phone number, so I just wanted to address what you talked to [My Husband] about. I have no interest in talking about those parties either.

I know [My Husband] asks about them sometimes, but I really could care less. Also, when you bring me a third party message from your father at a meet and greet with  [Relative's girlfriend], I now have to talk about it with you. I mean I could be rude, but I feel obligated if someone brings it up to me.

Also, you once brought it up as a starting conversation with [Relative's girlfriend] at diner, as her kids also don't have a relationship with their dad.

People I do not interact with are not my family, nor do I want to talk to them. I don't know if you noticed, but I never bring it up (sometimes [My Husband] does). So just don't mention them either, [My Husband] won't mention them, and I have no interest in mentioning them.

So if you bring up the subject in the future, I will close it down with you immediately. Again, I would have called you, and I am not mad. I am actually glad you brought it up, as it is not something pleasant for me NOR something I want to think about when I am just trying to hang out. And as far what family that I interact with are doing at family outings, I have not interest in that either.

That I am not mad part was not an actual lie at the time.   I have been conditioned to feel as if I should not BE mad.   I had intended not to be mad, but the bottom line is that I was angry that after so many discussions of not passing on messages that he did it.  I really should not have said what my husband will or will not do, he is free to bring up, answer, or talk about anything he wants to in HIS OWN HOUSE.

Relative on FB:  I agree [Relative] Let's not discuss [Sperm Donor], [Step Monster], any third-party messages from my Parents, or Family Gatherings. My number is (NOE) MPA-THY!
...and, let the record state that [His Girlfriend] and I wanted to visit tomorrow! ;)

The "for the record" part slays me.  Yes, let's state that for appearances sake, we have a very tight and warm relationship.  I would like this documented "for the record".   And "for the record' he was told why I would not want him to come in the first place, so this is a favor to me in what way?

Me on FB:  Yes, I know. It has been way busy here, and I am not up for any company right now. I will probably be asleep for most of tomorrow OR spending some much needed alone time with [My Husband].

BTW if you want to try and plan something the week of August 13th is looking good. I was planning to take some major time off then.

And then after a few days of worrying that he would actually take me up on this, AND do that by having a last minute "duty call"....I took care of this inadvertent and conditioned brain fart on my part.   I would like to say that I wish I did not have to deal with this and have the brain fart in the first place.   However, this helps me clear up some things that have been bothering me.   This is when I was spending time agonizing as to whether to do the right thing and call OR the "wrong" thing with MY well being in mind for once.

Me on FB:  Actually to tell you the truth, the above invite was given in a moment of guilt for being too tired and busy to see you last minute. I am really looking forward to my time next week, and you tend to be a bit of work to have over. Between now having to worry about putting up family photos where you might not (or Irene might not think you are perfect), having to worry about saying it was nice to have [you] here on Facebook so the wrong person doesn't see, needing to be available to receive you at a moments notice no matter what is going on in my life, and really you and [My Husband] more have the relationship than you and me. And many times you make it seem like some kind of favor that you are visiting me (and sometimes we all know you have had another agenda for coming over here), and often pass judgements or bring up my relationships with other people. Now my purpose here is not necessarily to sever my relationship with you, but I think it's important to have a mutally beneficial give and take relationship. Right now, you and I do not have that. And the one time it was fun and pleasant to have you over (the beach), you needed to make a drama about that over your picture. And whatever, if you don't want pics taken of you just say so. If you don't want your girlfriend to know you are here, either don't come or let her know you were here.

I have had enough dysfunctional relationships in my life. and this is a sort of dysfunctional way to talk to you, but I want to go on with my week just enjoying myself, and not worryign that I am going to get a last minute call that you are coming over. I have my brother in law, niece,and nephew here to enjoy, and I just want to stop worrying about this.

And as dysfunctional as it is. I don't want to talk about this this week or next week. Nor do I want messages passed to me through my husband. Thanks.

Relative on FB:   I'm glad your feelings to me. I completely understand and now that we've communicated about this, I hope we can work on re-establishing a better relationship. Love you

Quite frankly, I don't think this relative "completely understand"s how I feel.   This relative does not completely understand how anyone feels unless something very similar has happened to him.   What I am trying to say is the genetic lack of empathy appears to be alive and well in this relative.   We have talked about things that would provide for this "better relationship" not in that context but as plain courtesy.   And as yet courtesy has not been forwarded to me very often.

Me on FB:   Thanks, we will talk at a later date.


So it will be helpful to do the exercise at the very beginning of the post before our phone conversation (should this person be interested in having a phone conversation).

1. I feel guilty, because I did not want visits from you "on the fly".   I feel guilty also for allowing you to use my husband as a third party vehicle (and therefore I was also using you as a third party vehicle as I did not want to talk to you in person about this), and not directly confronting you about this more honestly and sooner.  I also feel guilty about the way that I choose to respond to you before taking my time off.   However, after consideration, I really needed to take care of myself first.
2. (I've thought about this a lot, so I don't feel resentment at the feeling but I certainly did at the time, so I am going forward with the next step)  
3. I feel resentful as I have personally told you before that it is not always a good time to visit.   I know that you think if you are visiting "my parents" in the area, that you think I will be hurt because you do not come.   I am hurt that my relatives do not make plans with me (that are enjoyable and agreeable) before hand, and instead come unexpectedly for their "duty visit".   It is this that I resent.   If you did not visit during a visit to "my parents" I would not be hurt.   I have always told you that I would like to plan something fun for all of us, and so that the house is clean ET and since I work from home so that I don't have schedule conflicts.   The fact that you ignore this is what I resent.   I also resent that you indicated to my husband what topics could not be of conversation.   Not so much because of the topic at hand, but because you weren't even invited over and you brought up something that is particularly painful to me out of the blue.  Thereby interrupting my day (when you weren't going to be here and I was having a good day) with something disturbing to me, and you communicated that through a third party (link is to an instance where he delived a message to me from his father), my husband.  We have also personally had conversations about that.  
4. Yes I see those demands in my head right now, and they are as follows...
5. One if this person feels the need to edit topics at hand (that they bring up by the way by making comments that indicate that I should feel guilt over the estrangement to "my parents"), and have a problem with every visit---perhaps they should not be visiting.   I am not that close to this person.   They are okay, and I have felt beholden since they "grace" me with their last minute company to cleave onto this final FOO relationship, but if it continues in this one sided and thoughtless way it is not something that I need in my life.  So I guess my demand is planned outings whether they coincide with their trip to their girlfriend or "my parents"  or not.  I am not a duty dropping by place, and it is not enjoyable for me to be used as such.  Demand two is that I do not need (nor do you need to bitch to my husband about anything) third party messages from you.   Demand two continues to an old discussion where I don't need any third party messages brought to me from other relatives that can not pick up the phone and call me directly themselves.   Demand three, you never ever need to bring up "my parents" to me by saying things like "don't you miss them" or "they don't appear to be doing well".   I am fully capable of communicating my feelings to "my parents" myself, and they are still possessed of the ability to communicate to me at any time they wish to.   We do not need a third party intervention from people who have not lived and do not empathize.   I am through having to justify myself to someone, and if I need to continue hearing that from you (and then editing what I say in response, though I just don't want to hear it in the first place quite frankly) then we do not need to be visiting each other.

When your upbringing may hindered ones ability to communicate on the fly, sometimes it takes a plan to communicate.   Sitting down and thinking these things out can help you  more effectively communicate, and sometimes save a relationship (if it's worth saving in the first place).

Anyway, the ball is in my other relatives court, as I called to talk to him.   Had to leave a message on the answering machine, but there the first step has been made.  I stuck to what I said I would do, partly out of duty and partly out of interest to see if I can salvage a relationship out of my FOO. If he is interested in salvaging a relationship with me he will call, if not...I am ready to let it go.

Officially on my semi vacation

It's a semi vacation because I have two days that are off (not in a row).   Other days where I have work scheduled but not that crunchy and not taking on any last minute new clients this week.   It will be different if a current client has an emergency, as I am here.   Other than that though,  doing fun stuff this week.   And not one of my FOO is in my head or thoughts.  Other than I had to think about them to write the previous sentence.

Going to see the local sights, get a soft serve cone, and relax on the beach.   Also boogey board in the waves.  I'm going to spend some quality time with my husband, my dogs, and any family or friend that I truly wish to see and spend my coveted time off with.  If I don't want to spend this time off with a reader who knows me, they know who they are .   They also know why.

I work hard.   I deserve my time off to be peaceful, fun, and pleasant.  That is what I work towards, and look forward to.   And because I love what I do, I don't take that much time off at all.   In fact the last time was 2009, and my dog, Jackie CD, died at the very beginning of that "vacation" due to complications with his digestive system.   (problems he had all his life, unfortunately, but we never thought would become fatal).  And before that the vacation was in 2005!  So why would I choose to spend that time with people who I don't particularly care for, and who don't particularly care for me (just their image).  I guess I was promoting my image too, by not being honest up front awhile ago.

All my vacations have not tended to happen in the summer either, as it is a very (and has been to date) time.   I am at my budget through August however, and the opportunity presented itself to me.   So by Dog, I will take advantage and enjoy a little summer reprieve from work and from pains in the asses.

It doesn't?

Ah, appropriate for some people that have been in my life previously.

Trying not to be passive aggressive here

The title of my post states that this blog has not been about all family members.  That is true, if you aren't talking about my side of the family LOL.   I have had some major growth points, where I no longer accepted being treated like the black sheep of the family by any and all family members.   It was no longer okay for these "family members" to drop in unannounced for their "duty visit" because they happened to be in the area once or twice a year.  Then it was expected that I drop everything because they deigned to show up on my doorstep one day.  (Often with one agenda or another in mind)  That or the annual Christmas card, which I just stopped returning.   I mean who are we kidding.  

For the family that matters to me, we get together whenever we can.   Which may not be frequent, but is meaningful.  They are not perfect either, but  they have real feelings, thoughts, and caring to share.   My side of the family (excluding my grandparents), it's all just superficial.   I am over it, I have been over it, and I have said it again and again.   Now I am just trying to figure out how to communicate this to the last hanger oner of the "duty call" and very huge favor to me with the bestowal of their last minute unplanned for company, which comes with an agenda and things to worry about.  You know. like:

1. Not to mention their visit so their girlfriend, fiance, or whatever does not find out about it for God knows what reason.  Yes, I have not had enough dysfunctional relationships in my life, now I need to worry about yours.   I get to be intimately involved in it.  Here is a solution, don't come here.   Or tell your girlfriend you are coming here.   And leave me the FUCK out of it.
2. Did I mention the last minute drop overs.   The last one occurred while I was travelling back from an eight hour day from a dog show.   They wanted to be sure they were STILL their to greet me.   I wanted a nap and a stiff drink.   Luckily I took to long (perhaps it was that ice cream detour with my dog that just happened after I knew they were at my house) for them to be there.   Too bad, so sad.   I did however get to worry about how I was going to rouse myself to entertain their asses.  Or plaster on a smile as if I was utterly thrilled to see them.
3. As 2 would indicate, there is never a thought that we have lives, and sometimes it is not convenient for us to have visitors unannounced or announcing they are coming by the day before.
4. The one visit we had a good time (again last minute so I had a hard time clearing my schedule), we went to the beach.   I had to keep travelling back and forth to take care of the dogs.   Anyway, later I put up some pictures of all at the beach.   This person put up such a stink because they didn't think they looked good in the picture, and I took it down.   But the friggin drama and agenda this person has all the time.
5. The time I saw this person the most was during their divorce.   And we got to be regaled with every online woman they were going to hook up with.   And you know, that was okay because I knew they were having a hard time.   A little tiring for me to feign interest.   We also got to hear every nasty thing he had to say about his ex.  And while there are some fronts I would agree on, this person is not a stupid person, and she was described as such and/or someone who needed to provide certain services.   As a woman, I thought the things that were said did not show just a lack of respect for his ex (and mother of his children), but a huge lack of respect for woman in general.
6. Unless something has happened directly to this person, they can not empathize with the going ons in others lives.  And even if it did happen to them and they say can imagine, it is only in context to their narrow experience.
7. And lastly, one of those people who is pretty sure that the world revolves around them.  I do have other friends like that, but there is a portion of their personality that is interested in other people and things.
8. Also this person has no problem sending me messages through my husband, instead of talking to me directly.   Or sending me messages from other relatives about my estrangement from Spermy (not my lack of interest in them, or their "interest" in me, which is non existent).

So perhaps right this moment is not the time to have a direct conversation, cause I am kinda really annoyed.  I am annoyed really at myself, because in my husband being clear not to drop by last minute the last time, I said if you want to plan a visit, you could come on this covetted week.  And I don't want them to come at all.   That was really a "duty" response on my part.   I am really not sure that I want to continue a relationship at all.

The reasons of this person for continuing a relationship with "me" is not about just duty.   For awhile, my husband was doing him personal favors.   Then I think he needs other couples to hang around with his girlfriend, and to show that he "cares" about family no matter how superficial that might be.   So I feel always on stage, always being judged, and if I am being granted some sort of favor.   If this person was not related to me, and someone I did not see once or twice a year for the first 18 years of my life, I would have zero to do with them.   I have been somewhat touched that they have sought to keep in contact with me, but as I have stressed that was not really their motivation.

And now they are taking up my time by me having to think up ways to tell them politely to FUCK OFF.  I am so over relationships like this that are draining rather than a give and take.